In this episode I turn the tables on Heather Stagl, the host of Influence Change at Work on Enclaria Radio. We talk about change resistance, change readiness, social media and change and her new book – The Influence Change at Work Toolkit.









How did you first get into organisational change?

Started as an industrial engineer – process improvement, efficiencies and effectiveness. You realise fairly quickly that the math doesn’t convince people to change things! Did a MBA that focused on leadership and change management. Double hatted in her role to do change management alongside the industrial engineering – “one foot in the clouds and one foot on the ground”

What insights did this give you on people in the organisation who have to double hat on change projects?

I highlighted the importance of moving away from role of ‘expert’ to ‘engagement’

How have you defined change resistance?

Any force that slows down or prevents motion (dictionary) – we’ve adopted that in change, but really it’s more like resistance means that other people aren’t changing when we want them too. It’s highly subjective. It doesn’t happen unless we expect something different to occur.

What was the response to your TEDX Talk?

The punch line was resistance is not something to overcome, it’s too uncover. The feedback suggested that people resonated with what people do to resist change eg procrastinate, avoidance, aggression.

New book coming out – Influence Change at Work Tool kit.

Whole section on resistance and the sources of resistance

How has your thinking on change resistance since the TEDx talk?

In the tool kit I dig into the 8 sources of resistance

  1. Valid concerns
  2. Lack of information
  3. Skills deficit
  4. Low motivation
  5. No power
  6. Fear
  7. Absence of Trust
  8. Scarcity of resources

When you have used those 8 sources of resistance with managers do any stand out straight away or are there some they don’t want accept.

The one that’s hard for leaders to accept is no power. If someone who works for them does not feel empowered, that’s on them. They need to look in the mirror to see what they are doing is disempowering.

One of the prevailing views in the change world is we shouldn’t focus on change resistance, we should focus on change readiness. Focussing on change resistance puts blame on the employee. What’s your view of that view?

If we just focus on readiness, and don’t discuss resistance we’re ignoring our own feelings during change. Looking at resistance is a gateway to empathy. What are the reasons why they seem to be resisting rather than blaming people.

What’s your thinking on change readiness?

Here’s Heather’s readiness assessment

  • Are individual’s ready for change?
  • Is the organisation ready for change?
  • Is the project ready for change?
  • Am I as change agent ready for change?

What’s your view on social media scene and change management?

I’ve made a lot of friends that way?! That’s been helpful for us to bond and challenge each other – it’s nice to have a community to put stuff out there and get feedback on, to either challenge us or encourage us.

Are many of your clients using social media in their change efforts?

Starting to see people experiment with tools like slack for collaboration.

2017 – what’s got you excited about change management

I’m interested to see where certification goes – CCMP (ACMP).

Interested also to see emerging fields eg Agile, Lean and how that fits with change. Change has always been one of those fields where you can take things from other fields.

You can see Heather in her TEDXtalk here


And access her Toolkit here

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